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Saturn; Men that mistreat and have an inability to relate to women

I have been thinking about men that have an inability to relate or treat women well lately. As accusations have popped up in the media I have periodically checked the accused Natal Charts and felt the majority of those whose behavior was questionable almost if not always had an afflicted Moon and/or Venus. The Moon and Venus are the feminine principals in the natal chart. The Moon is associated with our needs and our relationship with women starting with our own Mother and Venus correlates with the relationship aspect; it represents how we receive and reciprocate love.

Almost all of the men listed have Moon in Capricorn, Venus or Moon in Hard aspect to Saturn or Venus in Capricorn (at least the ones I am familiar with)

Charlie Rose
Harvey Weinstein
James Toback
Ray Moore
Louis CK
Brett Ratner
Paul Haggis
Tony Robbins

This is NOT to say everyone will have the Harvey Weinstein way of abusing women, but having the Moon or Venus in the 10th house, in Capricorn or having Venus or the Moon in hard aspect (conjunction, square, opposition) to Saturn suggests at the very least an inability to relate to women and perhaps a propensity to disregard women, love, and the emotional side of oneself.

Anytime we are speaking of Saturn aspects and planets in Capricorn; along with personal planets; we are speaking of restrictive and an uncomfortable expression of the planet. Personal planets placed in Capricorn are awkward in expression, serious and melancholic. After all they are filtered through Saturn.

Saturn is the planet of authority in astrology, where it is placed a person feels blocked and restricted. Saturn placements come with fear and apprehension. So when we have Saturn associated with the Moon there is an inherit fear of perhaps opening up emotionally and when Saturn correlates to Venus at the VERY least an inability or struggle to give and receive love. That part of us is blocked and takes a bit of work to overcome.

Let’s take a look at Saturn described by various astrologers:

“It is Saturn’s nature to play a specific role, which is parental, and authoritive and which speaks to the wayward child within. The kind of authority Saturn represents is also sternly patriarchal. It stands for cold logic, structure, and discipline” –Katharine Merlin

So the person that has Saturn afflicting or in aspect to their personal planets wants to hold all of the control. There is an element of not wanting to meet someone ½ way. I have Saturn in my 7th house so I know this well. I attract ridged types and I am also aware of my tendency in the past to want things completely my way or the high way. But there is no place in love for rigid behavior or making demands, love needs to flow like water, free and unencumbered.

Saturn’s energy can be restrictive and miserly think of the 4 of pentacles Tarot card which is associated with Mars in Capricorn this is the person- (IMO)-that looks like someone that is blocked off to love, holds everything close to the vest, guarding the heart chakra with a big pentacle.

4 of pentacles

“Because Saturn’s energy is naturally constrictive wherever Saturn is found in the natal chart there is often an area or part of life characterized by a sense of lack or even emptiness. For this reason a strongly placed Saturn can indicate a dominant sense of inadequacy in the basic character structure, fear. Rigidly and insecurity often covered up by behavior which blindly conforms to external values and to the voice of authority” –Katharine Merlin

“Difficult aspects between Saturn and other planets indicate blocks between the conscience/superego and the other parts of psyche and its within such aspects that many neurotic conflicts take shape” –Katharine Merlin

All of this energy is carried over to the intimate relationships when Saturn is associated with Moon and Venus in a man’s natal chart. SO here you have the attitude of

I am in charge

I am the boss

I say when

I am the one to dictate, plan and control

The ever defiant: I will not let you in

“Saturn is the no saying parent as well as the withholding, denying, and even punitive outer experience. The effect is blockage and contraction as well as inner conflict and fear” –Katharine Merlin

Anyone that has ever cared for one of these men can tell you it is like having a door slammed in your face again and again. All of the inherit defense mechanisms are activated in relationships as well as the unconscious fear of not being truly lovable.

It would seem the harder you try to get close to them often the more outlandishly unacceptable the behavior becomes.

The swing is wide with this variety of men anywhere from the Harvey Weinsteins to those that remain trapped IN fear consciousness and run away from intimacy, often projecting the lack on to intimate partners in seek of perfection.

Moon In Capricorn or in hard aspect to Saturn or in the 10th house

The Moon is not well placed in Capricorn; it is similar to Saturn in the 4th house, Moon in the 10th house and Moon in hard aspect to Saturn. This reflects the coolness of the mother figure, perhaps growing up in an environment where the child had to act as an adult, or the Mother was inhibited in showing emotional expression. In turn the child turns into an adult that is emotionally repressed, distant and has difficulty expressing affection, this is a common placement in those that over drink and can show an inability to connect with women in an easy manner.

Some Famous men with this placement –George Clooney, he married later in life, Brad Pitt who has recently opened up about his alcohol addiction, Johnny Depp, Gerard Butler, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Matt Damon, Ryan Gosling , David Beckham and Andrew McCarthy he has moon in Capricorn and Saturn square Venus and has been very open about his fear of commitment.

Moon in Capricorn: “ruled by Saturn which is structuring and extremely controlling energy; tend to hold the Moons energy in; an uncomfortable, place for its emotionality and changeability to operate. –Katharine Merlin

Moon in Capricorn: “like the rings of Saturn this guy surrounds himself with a protective wall, striving not to rely on anyone. He draws clear boundaries so nobody gets to close. The safest emotion is well controlled-depression-anger, aggression and even joy are too apt to rock the boat” –Donna Cunningham

Moon in Capricorn: “instinctive reactions to life that are characterized by self-control and caution, and sometimes by defensiveness or negativity that is almost shocking” –Stephen Arroyo

On the challenging end planets and points placed in Capricorn are depressing; Saturn squelches all the joy and jubilance out of the placement, making it restricted, fearful and cautious. (I believe hard aspects can be overcome with conscious awareness and effort)

Not only will a man with moon in Capricorn or in hard aspect be strongly melancholic and have difficulty relating to women they also have an underlining fear of not getting their own needs met.

When we see the moon making a hard aspect to Saturn or Saturn placed in the 4th house or the moon placed in the 10th house the emotions are unable to freely flow they are repressed and blocked. If a man can not relate to himself emotionally (or any gender for that matter) how will they be able to adequately relate, respect and understand the emotions of a woman? Unless they are actively choosing a life geared toward breaking karmic, parental/societal conditioning, toxic masculinity and patriarchal dominance. These aspects suppress the yin energy within oneself, hence they are cut off and do not have access to it.

Moon square Saturn: “A male with this aspect feels that women are not to be trusted…he may feel that it isn’t masculine to care, to be emotional to be responsive” – Donna Cunningham

Moon opposite Saturn: “some of these men marry women they do not love and carry on love affairs outside the marital relationship, for they don’t wish to establish a secure marriage with someone they love. The attitude seems to be based on the fear of loss of love” –Donna Cunningahm

Moon Opposite Saturn: “Some men feel they cannot demonstrate love on an emotional level, contact with women is merely sexual” –Donna Cunnigham

Venus in Capricorn, Venus in hard aspect to Saturn or Venus in the 10th house

Venus in Capricorn: “There is a great deal of self-control and self-containment. The deeper emotions are rather hard to express and they would rather show their feelings or appreciation for another person through action or duty rather than verbalization” –Stephen Arroyo

Venus in Capricorn: “Authority and control are two keynotes of the sign of Capricorn and they are expressed here as a need to have some kind of control over other people in most types of relationships or to recognize issues of power in interpersonal dealings” –Stephen Arroyo

Venus square Saturn: “this square shows a great deal of contractedness, fear and inhibition, -in terms of the ability to love and be loved in return……..the problem is that for various of reasons on a deeply internal and unconscious level there’s an ingrained conviction that one is not lovable, so that those who do show love are viewed with suspicion and ultimately rejected while those who withhold love galvanize and fascinate” –Katharine Merlin

Venus opposite Saturn: “Like the square this opposition shows emotional contradiction and inhibition. Outward forms-duty, obligation and role playing often take precedence over the hearts inclinations…..the female principal and maternal image tends to be negative; vulnerability and needs are perceived as weakness”- Katharine Merlin

Venus Opposite Saturn: “This often represents an individual who has losses in love because the psyche is programmed to lose; this individual may fall in love, with someone who is unavailable or with someone who dies or makes him intensely miserable” – Betty Lundstead

Regarding Saturn in aspect to Venus generally speaking Betty Lundsted: “The hard aspects between these planets sometimes cause an individual to pursue only career goals, for the emotional life may be suppressed”. If we become a victim of the aspect we often create the same relationship problems our parents had, we project our parents’ values onto those people we love and we may develop an extremely pessimistic attitude about loving. When pessimism is rampant it usually indicates that all the energies are put into the accumulation of money, for money is a trustable commodity”.

Some famous men with Saturn square or opposite Venus; Again we see Johnny Depp, we also have Robert Deniro, Bruce Willis, Bill Maher, James Franco, Jude Law, Gerard Butler, Matt Damon, Frank Sinatra, Michael Phelps, (a lot of politicians have the opposition ) John McCain, Ted Cruz are 2 samples off the top.

You can see the ability to give and receive love is challenged; a person with these aspects may go towards someone unavailable and walk away from someone totally free. Naturally we must always look at the person’s entire natal chart to make full proper assessments as well as see how far they are in their personal life journey. It is not uncommon for men with this aspect to put up barriers (Saturn) when it comes to love, isolate themselves or shun and devalue the feminine parts of one’s self and the feminine principal in others in lieu of more worldly tangible accomplishments. At worst they are the Harvey Weinsteins of the world or they remain so tightly in their own self-protective bubble you will never be able to penetrate their walls.

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Saturn the Buzz Kill to Jupiter

I am tired, drained really, I do not have much energy and I feel the energy I do have is spent doing what I have to do, I don’t really have any excess to do the things I want to do. I have the Sun in the 5th house my identity, my journey if you will is centered around love and creativity. The 5th house is the house of joy; being weighed down with extra responsibilities is exhausting.

It is very important that you tend to your natal Sun, that you nourish it with the activities suggested by the house that it is placed in. 6th house Sun, fitness time and order will really help you flourish. If you have a 9th house Sun schedule a vacation or attend a lecture. Wherever our Sun is placed we need to remember to feed it.

Energetically I always run very high I have Sun square Moon, a Cardinal T square in my chart along with a Grand Fire Trine. Cardinal signs are doers. My Mom said she was going to buy me a makeup bag that read “I am busy” because I always am. I laugh at people that have the time to correct my grammatical errors on twitter, I am pretty sure they aren’t doing all that I do in a day. Running, going, writing, working, giving readings, taken a class, on and on and on until this week I hit a wall.

The culprit; Saturn is opposite my Jupiter via transit

Saturn Rules

  • Responsibility
  • Time
  • Work
  • Boundaries
  • Lessons
  • Practicality Zzzzzzz

According to Jeanne Avery in Astrological Aspects Your Inner Dialogs

Saturn “describes shoulds, musts, and ought’s”

“Saturn is the testing ground of life and indicates the greatest karmic lesson to be learned”

I don’t do Saturn very well.

I believe if you look to the natal chart you will see how hard a transit for you will be. Not all astrologers believe this; I think if you are heavy say Plutonian Pluto transits will be easier for you because you are familiar with that energy. I have Pluto square my Sun, opposite my Moon exact, trine Jupiter, sextile Saturn, Neptune & Midheaven and trine my Ascendant. Pluto is woven into me, death and rebirth it all comes naturally. I just finished a Pluto opposite Sun square Moon transit and it was pretty much all gravy.

But Saturn transits god you can find me lying in bed weeping.

I am just not very good with rules and structure I prefer to be free floating.

Saturn is now opposing my natal Jupiter in the 4th house it will be exact on New Year’s Eve Oh the joy

Jupiter Represents

  • Expansion
  • Optimism
  • Good Luck
  • Joy

“The Jupitarian quality is a marvelous combination of practicality and enthusiasm. The reverse quality is disappointment. If the aim is too high and the goals are missed the individual can be paralyzed by the letdown” –Jeanne Avery

You want to look where Jupiter and Sagittarius are placed in your natal chart to see where you feel lucky or optimistic. I have Sagittarius on my Midheaven, I think this gives me a hope that things will work out and when they don’t, I would say I am greatly disappointed. I usually work from an inner knowing which stems from my natal Jupiter in the 4th house. The 4th house is the root of the chart and reflects what we carry deep within us among other things. So, I have never been a 5-year planner I am a go with the flow listen to my own guidance sort of person.

I intuit mostly everything I do. I announced the other day at work I was booking a trip to Machu Piccchu and my colleague said Oh Peru…I had no idea where it even was! I sort of get called to do things

I have written before that I do not feel Jupiter brings us lotto wins or grand romances, I think it infuses the planet or house with an optimism and belief that everything will be ok and usually it is until it isn’t.

And that brings me to Saturn opposite Jupiter

Saturn squashes the belief, the optimism, the joy that Jupiter holds. It tests (Saturn always tests) your beliefs, your truths, your inner workings (if Jupiter is in the 4th house).

Robert Hand writes in his book Planets in Aspect about Saturn opposite Jupiter transit

“During this time your opportunities for growth and expansion are limited”.

PROBABLY BECAUSE YOU ARE TOO F&%ING TIRED TO DO ANYTHING

“You often feel as if your personal freedom is unduly limited by others”.

“This transit is a useful if not always pleasant encounter with reality”

Saturn squelches the joy and optimism of Jupiter don’t let anyone ever tell you any different.

For those of you that have this natal oppositions can work like a swinging door so you can be optimistic, joyful, overly eager and then fall victim to Saturn the disappointment, melancholy, and depression can kick in. Robert Plletier writes in “Planets in Aspect” those that have this natal

“You fluctuate between knowing what you are worth to having doubts about your value”

I know this isn’t the worst transit, (those will happen for me in 2018 when Saturn enters Capricorn, I seriously just finished recovering from Saturn in Libra) that’s the beauty that comes with age when you are young you think this will never end, when you are older and know astrology you can simply open your ephemeris and say I may have to drag my uninspired tired ass all the way through December but as of January 1st this transit is over and I can go back to being my high energy manic self perhaps with a few lessons in the bag.

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A different perspective on Saturn in the 6th house

The placement of Saturn in your natal chart indicates karma that needs to be worked off. Evidently in my last life I ran a major company was married as a preteen and lived happily ever after. Fast forward to present times I was born with Saturn in the 6th and 7th house delays in marriage (7th house), working my ass off without any reward (6th house) Yup that is Saturn for me.

Astrological books tell tales of marrying someone older and colder (Saturn in the 7th) and Saturn in the 6th indicates an individual that adheres to a serious routine. I’m calling bullshit! Perhaps for some people, Saturn in the 6th is indicative of adhering to a serious routine, but not for me. So here is my alternate definition of Saturn in the 6th; despising routine, feeling weighed down by repetitive patterns, doing the same shit results in sudden fits of narcolepsy. I once worked a 9 to 5 Saturday/Sunday off sort of job now I work evenings with 2 weekdays off. I prefer it that way, I have no desire to be some sort of drone waking up with the rest of the world, cramming into a packed E train, waiting on some long line at Starbucks… Ill pass. Recently I have began doing background “acting” work in my spare time & how utterly fascinating I find it! A different set every day, a different call time, and a variety of people to talk to. The assortment is delightful! I do wish I could stick to some sort of routine but sometimes I work 15 hours, another day I need to get up & write my monthly horoscopes for www.museemagazine.com and another day I’m rushing to a set of a TV show. I want to work out, really I do as I pass the gym in my building & occasionally find myself squeezing in 45 minutes on the elliptical I can’t help but think how boring it is. I wish I still smoked because that is the very best appetite suppressant! In terms of Saturn indicating working hard without reward that is certainly true, but fuck it! I never wanted to be crunching numbers, running my own company, that is so 5 lives ago I would rather work on a set of a film, post this blog, write some monthly horoscopes & grab a seat on my perfectly empty E train at 2pm

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Saturn Transiting 8th House, Show Me The Money

Saturn entered my 8th house over a year ago and I cannot wait for him to make his way out! Having Pluto and Uranus in my natal 8th house I’m accustomed to sudden change, introspection, seeking the truth and depths of situations. But Saturn in 8th house squaring my Sun and opposing my Moon has been dreadful. Life has been difficult to say the very least. The 8th house rules death, other people’s money, sex not in a love affair -fun sort of way like the 5th house, but more of a plutonian type. It’s hidden, scandalous, and obsessive. They say where Saturn is placed there is karma to be worked off, needless to say I have been working my ass off. I’m not the same as I was before. I feel like an orange, peeling a layer and another layer and as I shed my skin I just long to get to the juicy part. The good part, a better part of me.

Some Lessons of Saturn in 8th house

The House of Other Peoples Money

Saturn Transiting the 8th house often indicates a lack of help in finances. It rules the money of other people whereas the 2nd house is the money you earn. Saturn transiting the 8th house gives you a feeling of having to do everything on your own. Feeling utterly overwhelmed. You can have enough money, but somehow it isn’t enough and you will find people seldom want to help you while Saturn is in your 8th house. I must admit money has never played a bigger part in my life than in this year. I have worked since I was 14; I have traveled to Europe throughout the Caribbean and across the US on my own merit, putting myself through college and saving up to purchase my own home. Natal Saturn in the 6th house indicates everything I acquire is via my own effort. To be frank I have little regard or respect for people who simply have things handed to them. That being said this year has been one obstacle after another, financial road blocks and major setbacks. I was approved for a mortgage, but denied by a condo board, I’ve been through lost applications, hidden fees, flip taxes oh my! It has taken a toll on my being and there have been many nights I have thrown myself a pity party. Why me? Why is this happening? Recently I met a depressed former love for drinks (he has Saturn transiting his 7th YIKES); I said you have the house, the cars, the children and I feel like I have nothing. He was quick to assure me that money doesn’t equate happiness and sometimes a “pretty picture” Is simply that. A picture not a reality. Saturn lesson number 1; all that glitters isn’t gold. This one is going to take a while.

Lessons of Saturn

The House of Sharing & Intimacy

Natal most of my planets fall below the horizon, the focus on my stuff (Moon in 2nd house), My way of thinking (Mars in the 3rd house) my neighbors (Venus in 3rd house), my house & my roots (Jupiter in 4th house), My love affairs & my creative abilities (Sun in 5th house) my job (Mercury in the 6th house) and my health habits (Saturn in 6th house). Me Me Me! Saturn transiting my 8th house has changed the way in which I see relationships. Making me realize in order for any relationship to work there has to be a 50/50 give and take. Thinking in terms of “us” not how will this affect me? With an Aries Moon it is always “me first”. It has completely gutted the way in which I relate to the people around me. Coming face to face with my own inadequacies, learning that people are not perfect. No one is perfect. After a series of events that occurred leaving me devastated I was forced to go to others for help, lean on others for support and assistance. I’m the type of person that prefers to handle things alone, I rarely ask for favors but that has simply not been the case the last year or so. As I have had to depend on others to pick me up and dust me off when the purchase of my home fell through and a 100 other things went wrong. I feel as though I’m stretching and growing inside, but as painful as it has been I believe at the end of this transit, I will view it as a cathartic process.

Lessons of Saturn

Obsessions, Dark Love, Sex

Saturn in the 8th house will bring you face to face with your inner fears, the things you deny, perhaps haven’t even admitted to yourself. If you’re generally possessive in love it will bring you face to face with a love you cannot possess. Controlling tendencies, Saturn in the 8th house will bring relationships beyond control. It will drag to the surface all that lies beneath, pulling out your heart and stomping on the very fragment of your being while doing so. One quote that comes to mind:

You will encounter people who will serve as mirrors, mirroring back to you all that you lack. Circumstances that bring out your worst tendencies. Its painful. But you can use these times to grow and build on them. Release old behaviors that no longer serve you.

Lessons of Saturn

Death

Thankfully no one I know has died, growing up with Pluto in the 8th house I’m accustomed to those I love dying prematurely. I still have a year left. At this rate; fingers crossed. Perhaps more so I feel as though a part of me is passing away. There is the me before the Saturn transit blissfully unaware of so many things. I have come to know the darkest parts of me, what motivates me, what renders me helpless, what I yearn for. I feel the past far beneath me as I attempt to climb up from nothingness. It is the end of an era. That is the only way in which I can describe it. Funny enough unbeknownst to me my numerological year is Year number 9. It’s a year of completion and paying off karmic debts.

Saturn Lessons

Where you find Saturn, you will find Karmic Debts

They say Saturn Transiting your 8th house is a time to settle the Karmic Debt for the emotional choices you have made earlier in life. Am I paid up yet?? There is me BS and AS before Saturn and After Saturn transiting my 8th house. It has been painful and dark. I feel as though all I hoped for did not manifest. My dreams remain just that dreams. I have been hurt and I have been angry and above all I have experienced disappointment in love and in life. However I can see with 20/20 vision mistakes I have made. I’m learning the lessons of Saturn, to depend on people….but ah-ha be careful which people you depend on. No one is perfect. Love sometimes hurts and sometimes it’s beautiful. God willing you will be denied something or someone because someone or something GREATER is waiting. And most importantly I think I have learned that you have to live life in your own time, do things at your own pace and although I believe in fate something bigger than all of us are in charge. I have to give up my need to control everything. Breathe. Exhale. Look for the lessons because if you don’t get it the first time, it will come around a 2nd time. Forgive those that disappoint you because to wake up angry every day defeats YOU! Let go and let life take you wherever it decides. Saturn transiting your 8th house demands you let go above all else.